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Not really get excited from the sound. Weird problems.

Richardus Raymaker

August 08, 2017 18:34

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Not really getting excited from the audio emitter

I tried cuboid and sphere.
Sphere you can only set to 100 meters.
The cuboid you can set bigger but with one cuboid it did sound wrong. i now have 2 that i did need to place further apart. but when am almost in the center i still hear one side not, unless i rotate my head a bit. while the sound need to be almost same loudness in both ears. Because the tight short fall-off rate you not get the right effect or can compensate for other problems.

Fall-off rate is wrong. If you place them to close to each other you get the strange mixing sound, If you place it to far apart you not hear one side when the other is loud.

Left / right is reacting strange. It's pulling to fast the sound away from the left ear as example.

The interference you can stop or lower by making the mono track stereo.

Same as with shadows, it's all much better in edit mode then in publish mode. It does sounds better in edit mode to. Still a bit lost and puzzling. but it's the second time now that edit mode is better then published one.

23 comments

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  Malakina August 08, 2017 18:40

  did you calculate the sound occlusion? I didnt try a lot myself with it yet, but it seemed to me that also the distance of sounds and voices seemed to be better with the calculation done. I belive you got that option in the scene setting.

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  Richardus Raymaker August 08, 2017 18:57

  What calculation of occlusion ?
  And no voices are not playing part in this problems. it's just to get a sound right. And that is already respond in strange way.

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  Torley - Sansar August 08, 2017 19:12

  Richardus, can you please explain more about what you are trying to do with Sansar spatial audio?

  It'd be highly helpful if you can record a video with sound and post it here.

  Sansar's audio emitter falloff is similar to the physical world. In the future, we may allow changing it to unrealistic proportions.

  You can go to Tools menu > Scene Settings and disable Compute Scene Reverb, if you want your built scene's audio to sound the same as in the layout editor with audio preview. However, that also means it may sound "flatter" and less realistic, since there will be no reverb or occlusion calculated.

  Please see this for more info about how Sansar audio works: https://help.sansar.com/hc/en-us/sections/115001283208-Working-with-Audio

  Edited by Torley - Sansar August 08, 2017 19:13
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  Richardus Raymaker August 08, 2017 19:20

  Thanks for reply torley.

  
  I need to do the test again on empty domain without any obstacles etc. Then i can make more easy a recording to.

  It gives me problems for a while. i go test the  "Compute Scene Reverb" to. i need to reread that web page.

  Back later.

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  Richardus Raymaker August 08, 2017 21:44

  @torley. I have troubles to explain it easy. But let's try it. :)

  Here's the video.
  -The green dot is the center of the cuboid.
  -The red and blue ones the edges
  -When am still inside the cuboid, the audio quality change, depends on how you look.  Something i expect only to happen outside the cuboid.
  - The wav is stereo, i used mono first but that did sound worse. converted the mono to stereo.

  https://youtu.be/gKd4ryabXGU

  

  What i try to emulate is a sea coast, that i still hear from a distacne. yes there are some dunes between it.
  But along the coastline the sound need to be clear like you hear when you stay on the  green dot and have the blue one left and the red in the front.
  But i cannot get that clear sound everywhere, and that spoils the effect complete. I tried more audio emitters i tried the sphere.
  i tried it with mixed edges (very bad idea, i know that from SL) cuboid seems to give best result. But still not what i want.

  if you rotate one ear complete away from the sea you not hear it anymore when your outside the cubiod.
  That could possible be solved with extra entity at lower volume.

  Outside i try to get a sound that get softer on larger distance. But like i say you can emulate that with more audio emitters (a longer falloff would fix it to)

  Is there no audio emitter that does not use the filters for your avatar position, so audio not get muffled when you rotate ? Unless there's a bug.

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  Richardus Raymaker August 08, 2017 23:21

  @torley, i think for now i have with 3 spheres a setup that works for now. It need's lot's of experimenting. when you learned that it works later better.When the scene is published you can hear it and mabye some adjustments.

  And am pretty picky with sound settings.

   

  Thanks for the help @torley.

  Edited by Richardus Raymaker August 08, 2017 23:27
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  Malakina August 08, 2017 23:45

  I also noticed that the sound experience with VR is much different. like when you turn on VR mode you actually know from which direction sounds come from and in desktop mode not

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  Richardus Raymaker August 09, 2017 11:47

  ? I hear no difference between desktop headphone mode and HMD headphone mode.  I know not all desktop mainboard sound cards are really good that could make a difference.

  Edited by Richardus Raymaker August 09, 2017 11:47
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  Malakina August 09, 2017 12:10

  hm I was always under the impression having a different directional sound when I switched between desktop and VR mode.. in both cases I used the headphones of the VR headset.

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  Richardus Raymaker August 09, 2017 12:19

  Need to test that next time i use VR

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  Torley - Sansar August 09, 2017 13:28

  I'll answer these points in order, hopefully this will help with a few things:

  > Is there no audio emitter that does not use the filters for your avatar position, so audio not get muffled when you rotate ? Unless there's a bug.

  All these audio emitters are spatialized. Have you heard of the term HRTF before? We have our own implementation of this to simulate how real ears in the physical world will naturally filter sounds in various situations.

  There are times when I know it can sound unnatural in Sansar, like if you have two copies of the same audio emitter near each other and you're turning around, or it's especially noticeable if an emitter is playing broadband noise, like a wind sound. Reverb and careful design can help prevent that, and as I also earlier mentioned:

  Especially with larger areas, it can be helpful to spread smaller emitters (like multiple recordings of waves lapping) across the shore, layered atop larger audio volume emitters, to increase localized detail. It would also minimize the "phasey whooshing" sound you hear when you rotate your head, although there are some limitations to that. But it'd be more like how a real beach would sound different as you walk up and down it.

  > I also noticed that the sound experience with VR is much different. like when you turn on VR mode you actually know from which direction sounds come from and in desktop mode not

  This is expected, and there's bound to be a different based on several factors such as:

  • Your HMD headphones (like Oculus Rift's built-in ones) being different than your desktop headphones or speakers. (Malakina, not applicable in your case, as you mentioned.)
  • The physiological sensation of having your head movement naturally linked to what you're hearing — like how humans are inclined to tilt their head towards an interesting sound.
  • And furthermore, the change of having your vision surrounded by Sansar, as opposed to other external stimuli that may be distracting or negate what you're hearing in Sansar.

  While 1st-person desktop mode is closer than 3rd- for "hearing from a personal perspective", this highlights the joys of really "being there" in Sansar, in VR!

  Edited by Torley - Sansar August 09, 2017 13:28
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  Richardus Raymaker August 11, 2017 18:09

  @Malakina , i just checked it in VR. And your right VR  seems more precise then the desktop. it did sound different to. I need to turn the media volume down. With possible risk of  the other problem.

  Anyway, VR and desktop not sound the same. different sound cards to.

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  Richardus Raymaker August 15, 2017 13:38

  I would expect a wall is damping the sound.
  But the sound outside the building is on the straight axis  0,90,180,270 just the same loudness outside as inside the building. Now you can say, lower the radius of media. But then i get problems inside.

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  Livio Korobase August 15, 2017 14:30

  try with a true stereo sound, not a mono converted in stereo, is not the same thing.

  Edited by Livio Korobase August 15, 2017 14:32
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  Richardus Raymaker August 15, 2017 16:55

  It's already a youtube media stream. cannot make it more stereo then stereo :)

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  Livio Korobase August 16, 2017 08:48

  you writed " i used mono first but that did sound worse. converted the mono to stereo"... converted is not same than original stereo.

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  Richardus Raymaker August 16, 2017 10:35

  The original file where mono. like so many files.
  So i made it stereo by copy the same track to other channel.

  I first wanted to shift left and right a bit with start point. But really need to find a better audio editor. it did not work.

  It's not complete stereo, but it made the ocean works better.

  Edited by Richardus Raymaker August 16, 2017 10:36
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  Livio Korobase August 16, 2017 11:18

  yes i understand, but a track builded so is not stereo, is just the same sound doubled. During two-channel stereo recording, two microphone (at least) are placed in strategically chosen locations relative to the sound source, with both recording simultaneously. The two recorded channels will be similar, but each will have distinct time-of-arrival and sound-pressure-level information. During playback, the listener's brain uses those subtle differences in timing and sound level to triangulate the positions of the recorded objects. With the same signal doubled on left and right, this don't happen. For big area this is also more important i think... with a true stereo sound your ocean can work more well for sure.

  Edited by Livio Korobase August 16, 2017 11:19
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  Livio Korobase August 16, 2017 11:21

  for example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vwix03qLkI

   

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  Richardus Raymaker August 16, 2017 12:01

  Let me say ity different, a 2 channel audio file works betetr then 1 channel audio. Andi need to get the audio from cc0 source. so i have not the choice to make it real stereo.

  SO for now it works. until there's better material.

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  Galen August 16, 2017 14:05

  As far as I can tell, all spatialized (default) audio sources in Sansar are monophonic. Stereo doesn't really have meaning in a context where one sound source has a single location. If you wanted stereo audio in Sansar, you would need two sound emitters with different locations for "left" and "right".

  If you have the ability to do so, consider recording several different mono tracks of shoreline and play them on different emitters, as Torley suggested, just offshore. The combined effect should sound great, especially with an HMD on.

  If you have an experience that is nothing but shoreline, you could also use a single background sound that you would hear the same everywhere, but you would still want to layer in point source emitters to add a 3D texture to the soundscape.

  Edited by Galen August 16, 2017 14:06
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  Torley - Sansar August 16, 2017 14:58

  Stereo sounds DO make a difference in Sansar, in that when you rotate around a stereo audio emitter, it affects the stereo soundfield. Try it with a stereo sound that has extreme panning effects. So you need not restrict yourself to monophonic sounds.

  A similar thing is true for ambisonic sounds: https://sansar.zendesk.com/knowledge/articles/115001721746/en-us?brand_id=1004727

  There is a known issue — possibly part of what's happening above  — where sounds that are similar to white noise (possibly seashore) will sound abruptly panned/stepped when you move around them, even slowly. You can hear it if you drop a white noise sound emitter into layout editor, then turn audio preview on and move the camera around it. We'd like to improve this...

  Edited by Torley - Sansar August 16, 2017 14:59
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